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ViewMate Posting VM 25277

Submitted by Pat Hamilton

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Information Picture Question
Category: Interpretation
Approval Date: 12/19/2012 4:03 PM
Family Surname: CHORNEY CZORNY CHERNY
Country: Russia
Town: Belaya Tserkov
Date of Image: 1913
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Can you read the Father's name please of Nathan CHORNY, or Czorny, on line 24 of this shipping manifest?

Thanks for your ideas.

Pat

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On  Response 
12/20/2012 2:30 AM Hello Pat,

The given name of his father appears to be Izsek. Hopes this gives you something with which to work....Jo
12/20/2012 5:45 AM I agree that his father's name is Issek. His occupation was originally given as porter and then was overwritten with clerk.
12/20/2012 8:42 AM I don't see any s's in the name. I think he was Jorek, but perhaps his Hebrew name was Isaac - or Jacob or something else.
12/20/2012 9:59 AM What I'm seeing here is that your reading of "clerk" was added later on
after arrival. What I make out on the document is "pedlar." I think that
this is the arrival manifest after the transcription from the Hamburg lists
was put together. Have you a copy of the original Hamburg list? Usually
they were compiled in German, not English and upon boarding the data
might get discombobulated by another scribe! Hope this helps.
12/20/2012 10:02 AM Sorry for not addressing your question as to parent's name. It is entirely same as passenger. What you might see is the spillover from passenger
23's information. Lines were ofter very narrow and all was handwritten.

Good luck.
12/20/2012 11:41 AM Pat;
I would guess Father's name as Itzek. Based on the other "t"s (no cross on the rise) and the weak (almost printed) "z" of Czorney. These manifests were created in Europe. Do not expect the same style of writing as in the US or UK, even at this time.

Did you locate his Grave Stone?
The Father's Name is usually inscribed there in Hebrew and/or Yiddish or sometimes both. Itzek is Yiddish. Yakov in Hebrew. The Grave Stone may also have a "shem kodish," a Hebrew Name, used during rites of passage, but not as an everyday, common name. Good Luck, Anna
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